PA-28-140 Cherokee advice

[drclive]

I recently acquired a share in a Piper PA-28-140 Cherokee. Any of you
with a lot of hours and experience could give me some hints and tips
about this airplane? Thanks in advance.

[Clive]

Post by drclive
I recently acquired a share in a Piper PA-28-140 Cherokee. Any of you
with a lot of hours and experience could give me some hints and tips
about this airplane? Thanks in advance.

Is the a/c based at a hard strip or grass?

If grass, maybe a little slow getting airborne if near MTOW.

Clive

[david]

Do the weight and balance carefully.
Fly it a lot.
Enjoy it.
Come back and tell us about it!!

D

Post by drclive
I recently acquired a share in a Piper PA-28-140 Cherokee. Any of you
with a lot of hours and experience could give me some hints and tips
about this airplane? Thanks in advance.

[David Cartwright]

Post by drclive
I recently acquired a share in a Piper PA-28-140 Cherokee. Any of you
with a lot of hours and experience could give me some hints and tips
about this airplane? Thanks in advance.

Two things spring to mind, apart from the obvious advice to out and play all
you can, as the Cherokee is a lovely little aircraft.

First of all, just because it's a four-seater, don't assume you can get four
hairy blokes in it. Always do your weight and balance, because the chances
are you can only realistically get four in if there are children or scrawny
adults among them.

Second, if the runway you're landing on isn't desperately short, keep a
trickle of power on right into the flare and it'll cushion the landing
nicely. The Cherokee flies a bit like a PA-38 in this respect. The PA28-161
et al have a different wing which lets you float forever with the throttle
at idle, but the -140 doesn't float in the same way. Of course, this is
actually an attractive trait on a short field, when you want to get down on
the ground _now_, before you get to the hedge at the other end :-)

David C

[Gus Cabre]

As mentioned, it doesn't float as much as the 160 and 180s. I have always
treated it like the C150 I learned to fly in. It also has a docile stall
compared to the Cessna.

Don't carry 3 heavy blokes and full fuel, otherwise you'll get to learn
ground effects and slow ascending.

Gus
Coltishall

Post by drclive
I recently acquired a share in a Piper PA-28-140 Cherokee. Any of you
with a lot of hours and experience could give me some hints and tips
about this airplane? Thanks in advance.

[Neil G]

Post by Gus Cabre
As mentioned, it doesn't float as much as the 160 and 180s. I have always
treated it like the C150 I learned to fly in. It also has a docile stall
compared to the Cessna.
Don't carry 3 heavy blokes and full fuel, otherwise you'll get to learn
ground effects and slow ascending.
Gus
Coltishall

Gus, can you remember the V speeds? That'd help.

Can't forget you all-up in the Cherry into Knettishall kindly going
out of your way and giving people a lift to that fly-in.

Neil G

[David Cartwright]

Post by Neil G
Gus, can you remember the V speeds? That'd help.

Can't remember what the book says, as it's been a while, but if memory
serves it'll get off the ground at about 60-65kts (no flap - I'm used to
1.8km of runway :-), you'd fly an approach (or a glide) at 80kts, come over
the hedge at about 70kts (assuming normal flap setting, i.e. 25 degrees),
and a gentle flare gets you on the ground at 55-60.

It'll climb happily at 80kts, though if you want to get a bit more cooling
over the engine and you're not fussed about how quickly you climb, add
another five or ten. The latter is perhaps the main difference between
the -140 and, say, the -161 - the latter will climb happily at 90, but the
former is a little more pedestrian. Though this doesn't mean the -140 can't
be tremendous fun - I remember when I was a student (with an instructor who
was twenty-something going on sixteen), playing in the tops of the clouds,
pretending I was flying a fighter through the mountains - it's an agile
little aircraft.

D.

[Neil G]

On Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:37:31 +0100, "David Cartwright"

Post by David Cartwright

Post by Neil G
Gus, can you remember the V speeds? That'd help.

Can't remember what the book says, as it's been a while, but if memory
serves it'll get off the ground at about 60-65kts (no flap - I'm used to
1.8km of runway :-), you'd fly an approach (or a glide) at 80kts, come over
the hedge at about 70kts (assuming normal flap setting, i.e. 25 degrees),
and a gentle flare gets you on the ground at 55-60.
It'll climb happily at 80kts, though if you want to get a bit more cooling
over the engine and you're not fussed about how quickly you climb, add
another five or ten. The latter is perhaps the main difference between
the -140 and, say, the -161 - the latter will climb happily at 90, but the
former is a little more pedestrian. Though this doesn't mean the -140 can't
be tremendous fun - I remember when I was a student (with an instructor who
was twenty-something going on sixteen), playing in the tops of the clouds,
pretending I was flying a fighter through the mountains - it's an agile
little aircraft.
D.

I may end up flying cheaply on a Cherrytree during hte week hence my
interest.

Just Googled for a POH and found the below V speeds, which sound about
right

Vso Stall Speed, Flaps Down 55 mph
Vs1 Stall Speed, Flaps Up 64 mph
Vr Rotation Speed 65 mph
Vx Best Angle of Climb 74 mph
Vy Best Rate of Climb 85 mph
Vfe Flap Extension Speed 115 mph
Va Maneuvering Speed 126 mph
Vno Smooth Air Speed 137 mph
Vne Never Exceed Speed 168 mph
Best Glide Speed 85 mph
Maximum Crosswind 20 mph
Enroute Climb Speed 95 mph

[Gus Cabre]

Hi Neil,

Yep, those speeds sound about right.

Talking about the Knetishall fly-in it was 15 Sep 02 (just checked my log
book). Yes, I have several entries of Knetishall that date. The advice given
to drclive about not carrying more than two heavy adults was learned that
day :-))

Regards,

Gus
Coltishall

Post by Neil G
On Tue, 29 Aug 2006 21:37:31 +0100, "David Cartwright"

Post by David Cartwright

Post by Neil G
Gus, can you remember the V speeds? That'd help.

Can't remember what the book says, as it's been a while, but if memory
serves it'll get off the ground at about 60-65kts (no flap - I'm used to
1.8km of runway :-), you'd fly an approach (or a glide) at 80kts, come over
the hedge at about 70kts (assuming normal flap setting, i.e. 25 degrees),
and a gentle flare gets you on the ground at 55-60.
It'll climb happily at 80kts, though if you want to get a bit more cooling
over the engine and you're not fussed about how quickly you climb, add
another five or ten. The latter is perhaps the main difference between
the -140 and, say, the -161 - the latter will climb happily at 90, but the
former is a little more pedestrian. Though this doesn't mean the -140 can't
be tremendous fun - I remember when I was a student (with an instructor who
was twenty-something going on sixteen), playing in the tops of the clouds,
pretending I was flying a fighter through the mountains - it's an agile
little aircraft.
D.

I may end up flying cheaply on a Cherrytree during hte week hence my
interest.
Just Googled for a POH and found the below V speeds, which sound about
right
Vso Stall Speed, Flaps Down 55 mph
Vs1 Stall Speed, Flaps Up 64 mph
Vr Rotation Speed 65 mph
Vx Best Angle of Climb 74 mph
Vy Best Rate of Climb 85 mph
Vfe Flap Extension Speed 115 mph
Va Maneuvering Speed 126 mph
Vno Smooth Air Speed 137 mph
Vne Never Exceed Speed 168 mph
Best Glide Speed 85 mph
Maximum Crosswind 20 mph
Enroute Climb Speed 95 mph

[David Cartwright]

Post by Gus Cabre
Talking about the Knetishall fly-in it was 15 Sep 02 (just checked my log
book). Yes, I have several entries of Knetishall that date. The advice
given to drclive about not carrying more than two heavy adults was learned
that day :-))

Yup - even the more poweful Warrior (PA28-161) can't really take a pilot
plus three big people. I recall one day when we were taking the club's
entire fleet, and loads of members, on a trip. It was the first time I'd had
to do a calculation for four-up in the -161, and I was a little surprised,
given that these are supposedly four-seater aircraft, that the
weight-and-balance calculation came out quite as far over the limit as it
did. There was a little dischuffment from a couple of people when I pointed
out that I wasn't willing to fly overloaded, but fortunately we were able to
do a shuffling exercise and got everyone there legally. Interestingly, the
person who flew that aircraft back didn't even bother with the calculations
...

This all said, the numbers will always be a little conservative. I've seen
the Cherokee get off the ground and fly with four medium-sized adults (no, I
wasn't in it - I was in the -161 again, following him out). You need a bit
more runway than it says in the book, though :-)

D.